Comments on: Oliver Stone’s ‘Secret History of America’ Sympathetic to Stalin, Hitler, Mao

By: tiger tim

tiger tim — Tue, 24 Aug 2010 10:05:45 +0000

Stone’s acting the true, even if unwitting ‘son of Wall Street’
by, with his recent emapthetic Hitler/Stalin ‘revisionism’,
cooperating with the PC powers that be agenda of
grooming another, far more awesome, icon of genocide
for global acceptance and legitimacy.

Can you guess who?

HINT –unscramble the answer here —AMO.

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By: tiger tim

tiger tim — Wed, 07 Jul 2010 12:52:24 +0000

Isn’t ANYONE noticing? -son of Wall Street, NEVER poor former Yalie
and ‘daring rebel maverick’ Oliver Stone seems to have endless time
and money for stale 70′s radical recycling and cokehead cultural incest
like this

-WHILE-

as MILLIONS are suffering and dying ignored
and as 5 to 8000 US troops remain ‘missing’
GENUINE veteran Oliver Stone slavishly tows
the RED China suck-up Hollywood line by once again
‘mysteriously overlooking’ the staggeringly relevant, vital
and important 60th Anniversary of the KOREAN WAR —this year?

LOL —-cubed!

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By: michigan

michigan — Tue, 26 Jan 2010 19:13:30 +0000

Your first mistake Bob is Wiki anything. It’s an editable so called “encyclopedia” and who’s editing? Who knows? What does America stand for Bob? What have we done that’s good in your mind? Can you list anything?

I can.

1.The American Cemetery at Aisne-Marne, France. A total of 2289 of our military dead.

2. The American Cemetery at Ardennes, Belgium. A total of 5329 of our dead.

3. The American Cemetery at Brittany, France. A total of 4410 of our military dead. Excuse us.

4. Brookwood , England American Cemetery. A total of 468 of our dead.

5. Cambridge, England. 3812 of our military dead.

6. Epinal, France American Cemetery. A total of 5525 of our Military dead.

7. Flanders Field, Belgium. A total of 368 of our military.

8. Florence, Italy. A total of 4402 of our military dead.

9. Henri-Chapelle, Belgium. A total of 7992 of our military dead.

10. Lorraine, France. A total of 10,489 of our military dead.

11. Luxembourg, Luxembourg. A total of 5076 of our military dead.

12. Meuse-Argonne. A total of 14246 of our military dead.

13. Netherlands, Netherlands. A total of 8301 of our military dead.

14. Normandy, France. A total of 9387 of our military dead.

15. Oise-Aisne, France. A total of 6012 of our military dead.

16. Rhone, France. A total of 861 of our military dead.

17. Sicily, Italy. A total of 7861 of our military dead.

18. Somme, France. A total of 1844 of our military dead.

19. St. Mihiel, France. A total of 4153 of our military dead.

20. Suresnes, France. A total of 1541 of our military dead.

And after all that and more, we implemented the Marshall Plan.(You might want to wiki whatever that one).

All those country locations honor our dead for their sacrifices. For what Bob? I guess you have to figure that one out, but I’m thinking if it was something bad, those cemeteries would not be allowed to exist.

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By: Bob

Bob — Tue, 26 Jan 2010 18:06:09 +0000

“..We fight global domination, we respect sovereignty, and we are a just and moral nation….”

From Wikipedia; The 1954 Guatemalan coup d’état was a covert operation organized by the United States Central Intelligence Agency to overthrow Jacobo Arbenz Guzmán, the democratically-elected President of Guatemala. Arbenz’s government put forth a number of new policies, such as seizing and expropriating unused, unfarmed land that private corporations set aside long ago and giving the land to peasants, that the U.S. intelligence community deemed communist in nature and, suspecting Soviet influence, fueled a fear of Guatemala becoming what Allen Dulles described as a “Soviet beachhead in the western hemisphere”. Dulles’ concern reverberated within the CIA and the Eisenhower administration, in the context of the anti-communist fears of the McCarthyist era. Arbenz instigated sweeping land reform acts that antagonized the U.S.-based multinational United Fruit Company, which had large stakes in the old order of Guatemala and lobbied various levels of U.S. to take action against Arbenz. Both Dulles and his brother were shareholders of United Fruit Company.

Also from Wikipedia; Patrice Émery Lumumba was a Congolese independence leader and the first legally elected Prime Minister of the Republic of the Congo after he helped win its independence from Belgium in June 1960. Only ten weeks later, Lumumba’s government was deposed in a coup during the Congo Crisis. He was subsequently imprisoned and murdered in circumstances suggesting the support and complicity of the governments of Belgium and the United States. It was revealed that U.S. President Dwight D. Eisenhower had said “something [to CIA chief Allen Dulles] to the effect that Lumumba should be eliminated”.

This was revealed by a declassified interview with then-US National Security Council minutekeeper Robert Johnson released in August 2000 from Senate intelligence committee’s inquiry on covert action. The committee later found that while the CIA had conspired to kill Lumumba, it was not directly involved in the actual murder.

It was revealed that U.S. President Dwight D. Eisenhower had said “something [to CIA chief Allen Dulles] to the effect that Lumumba should be eliminated”. This was revealed by a declassified interview with then-US National Security Council minutekeeper Robert Johnson released in August 2000 from Senate intelligence committee’s inquiry on covert action. The committee later found that while the CIA had conspired to kill Lumumba, it was not directly involved in the actual murder.

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By: chilo

chilo — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 20:28:03 +0000

I apologize for my language, and although you may consider what i have to say as crap, thanks for letting me use your bandwith. (there is another f-word, 1st paragraph of my second reply you might want to take out).

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By: chilo

chilo — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 19:23:33 +0000

The germans had already surrendered when the bombs were dropped on japan–how much longer could japan have held out against the allies?
I don’t consider myself a “progressive” or affiliate myself with any specific group, and i can’t say i support the current administrations foreign policy any more than i supported the last ones. Oliver stone is not my basis for historical events, nor the academics that you write about.
Michigan, I can’t seem to convince you that i am not an “america hater,” but anyway….i think we both need to do a little more reading.
To the lonely conservative, i apologize for my language, and although you may consider what i have to say as crap, thanks for letting me use your bandwith.

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By: michigan

michigan — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 18:23:44 +0000

Your youth and naiveté bleeds through Chilo, so I consider this a “teachable moment”. There is no dispute in history except by “armchair quarterback America haters” like yourself that argues that dropping the A-bomb wasn’t warranted. You state:” But pearl harbor does not justify the massive bombings of japan. particularly two atomic bombs dropped at the end of WWII when japan was about to surrender.” Pathetically and factually historically inaccurate. Fact: They were not about to and did not surrender until the second bombing. Fact: All credible historians credit the bombings to saving lives overall or the war would have dragged on for years. Fact: There was a race on to create an atomic bomb and the Axis would have dropped if they had it first. You state: “So even if you consider cursor.org a bullshit website, and I don’t claim to support everything they might say,….” Then why even buy into it and proclaim it fact? You are incredible. I can only suggest doing some reading on the intent and founding of America. Those are the ideals we are expected to carry forward with and sustain. Our founders meant to for us to question and maintain government and leaders through the check and balances in our Constitution not “ people who blindly follow their leaders who are the “scourge of individual freedoms.” I would point to the supporters of the current administration and policies of which you are a supporter. Again, let me suggest you get your head out of progressivism and Oliver Stone’s remanufacturing of historical events, pick up some credible texts and read. I think you’re a young person that has been co-opted by academics with agendas. I know, I grew up with quite a few of them, they were the “square pegs” trying to fit into round holes and got bitter with their failures and retreated back to what they knew; school; and to this day these so called “academics” project and perpetuate their anguish and hate of the system on students. I know “I” won’t change anything you think, but a great book to pick up to read and study is “ The Making Of America” by Skousen. “ The Rise And Fall Of The Third Reich” by Shirer. I think you’ll find them enjoyable and enlightening.

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By: Lonely Conservative

Lonely Conservative — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 17:46:40 +0000

Dude, you’re lucky I’m letting you use my bandwidth to spew your crap, but please, watch your language. I just had to edit your comment. Do it again and you’ll be banned.

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By: chilo

chilo — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 17:36:18 +0000

I’ll repeat it one more time. Being critical of america does not make me a hater. Nor does referring to it as an empire. England used to be an empire, rome used to be an empire, etc.etc.
And i did not conveniently forget the events you mentioned above. But pearl harbor does not justify the massive bombings of japan. particularly two atomic bombs dropped at the end of WWII when japan was about to surrender. And what about the fact that american involvment in vietnam led to the rise of pol pots regime. And why was america involved in a civil war in vietnam–leading to the deaths of many americans and vietnamese? And 9-11??? Who is responsible for 9-11? Bin Laden has not claimed responsibility for it. AND NO, America has not ALWAYS stood for individual freedom. Back in the days of the cold war, america supported many regimes that suppressed/executed their own people. I have relatives who were jailed and tortured because of their political beliefs. Not because they were terrorists or spies or criminals.
So even if you consider cursor.org a bullshit website, and i don’t claim to support everything they might say, i was simply sending you a list of civilian victims in an aggressive/preemptive?? war led by america. (because you asked for numbers–which are collected through various news agencies as listed). Now i assume your argument here will be that america is defending itself by attacking afghanistan, or defending the freedom of the afghanis. But how does bombing civilians defend their freedom? Is that just a necessary evil to win the “war on terror” (an absurd contradiction in itself)? all that has achieved so far is the creation of more terrorists and more “america haters.” If american is such a just and moral nation, why are there so many people who hate it?
And no i am not lumping america as one big bad nation, but it has not always been a force of good, nor has it always been just and moral. you say that my beliefs are what weaken men and liberty, but maybe it is people who blindly follow their leaders who are the “scourge of individual freedoms.”
America was founded on noble ideas, and it has inspired many positive things in the world, but america has also done a lot of ****ed up sh**. and it’s a shame you can’t acknowledge that.

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By: michigan

michigan — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 15:40:54 +0000

Nice try comrade, you had better finish your Wiki search and find out through some rational and factual history why all those instances occurred. You cherry pick Rummel for numbers and demographics and you don’t mention the conclusion of his thesis in his many books. You are definitely an America hater, calling her empirical. Again Chilo, you are so steeped into hating America, you can’t distinguish the morality in and of deaths. You are the poster child of relativism, pulling out those, oh so old arguments of past wars that are somehow supposed to be convincing that we’ve done wrong. Why did you conveniently forget to mention Pearl Harbor, the Viet Cong, North Korea, 9-11, Pol Pot? I’ll say that some American “people” do bad things, but you lumping America as a whole that we’ve done wrong and painting us as an empire and aggressor is just false. We have and always will stand for individual freedom. We fight global domination, we respect sovereignty, and we are a just and moral nation. You seem to have forgotten or choose to ignore that we have the right to defend ourselves. Wars are horrible but inactions and thinking of those like you, that cultivates aggression and attracts men with ideologies whose nature it is to conquer the weak is what causes them. When that happens, we must stand strong to be a force of good. If you would bother to read our founders, but no, you cite the Progressive web site cursor.org, a defunct, financially broke entity that couldn’t exist in any system because people don’t WANT to read its hate and lies. You are a progressive Chilo, you are an “America as it was founded and exists hater”. You are the ideological cancer that weakens men and liberty. Progressives like you are the scourge of individual freedoms. I guess you did get me on a point, you probably don’t watch MTV; now with a clearer picture of yourself, I would expect you to be a CCTV viewer wearing your Mao or Che Guevara tee. Wise up.

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By: chilo

chilo — Wed, 20 Jan 2010 14:16:50 +0000

Well Michigan, here is a sample of civilian deaths caused by US forces in the past 60 years. I could keep going if you want, but i have a feeling you might not read it. In fact if you do a little research of your own, you will find a wealth of information that might poke your bubble a little bit. But I suppose these are all just minor “mistakes” that america has commited. And no,i am not an america hater. There are many things I admire about this country. But that does not mean we should ignore injustice or abuses when our leaders try to convince us that they are necessary. Perhaps i should not have drawn a parallel to nazi germany–it tends to get people upset, but my point was not that america is evil. My point was that america is a powerful nation/empire that has the ability to control and influence many. And that power has caused death and destruction for some. and for **ck’s sake, i do not watch mtv.

70,000–80,000 people, or some 30%[28] of the population of Hiroshima were killed immediately, and another 70,000 injured.[29] Over 90% of the doctors and 93% of the nurses in Hiroshima were killed or injured.[30]

(Nagasaki)Casualty estimates for immediate deaths range from 40,000 to 75,000.[58][59][60] Total deaths by the end of 1945 may have reached 80,000.[4]
(from Atomic bombings of hiroshima and nagasaki-Wikipedia)

US forces killed an estimated 90,000 South Vietnamese civilians due to their extensive use of fire power (artilery, bombings, small weapons). Another 1,500 were killed in various massacres. Again, these are deaths caused by US Forces apart from combat deaths inflicted on North Vietnames forces. Rreference: R.J. Rummel (1997). “Table 6.1A Vietnam Democide: Estimates, Sources & Calculations”. Lines 589 & 601. web site

Afghan civilians killed in a 2 month period.
http://cursor.org/stories/casualty_count.htm

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By: michigan

michigan — Mon, 18 Jan 2010 17:07:36 +0000

Yeah Chilo, we’re all brainwashed; right. “Slaughtered thousands of people in its attempt to build and maintain an empire”. Who, where, why? All of you America haters paint with broad brushes with no specificity, just outright false accusations. I say “prove it”. Show me the thousands slaughtered by Americans, show me the brainwashing. You won’t and you can’t. All countries make mistakes, that’s just life and the imperfection of humanity. People like you, riddled with false guilt and ideological relativism make a weak target for individual freedom and liberty anywhere to be lost, because it’s the nature of man to conquer them. America does the best job protecting those two ideals, and if you think not, I’m callin’ you out Chilo; who’s done better than America? Yeah, America the “taker” Chilo, have you turned on your television the past few days to view anything other than MTV? I point to a little humanitarian effort lead by America (again) in Haiti if you haven’t heard.

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By: chilo

chilo — Mon, 18 Jan 2010 12:03:14 +0000

Everybody is biased. What is more frightening is that we are equally brainwashed as the germans of nazi germany. we knowingly, or unknowingly, support a government(s) that has slaughtered thousands of people in it’s attempt to build and maintain an empire. Certainly not through concentration camps, but if you add all the victims of vietnam, iraq, afghanistan, and all those dictatorships that the US assisted in south america, i’m sure the numbers will add up. And don’t tell me it was all done for freedom and democracy. Hitler used fear to motivate the germans, and the last administration used similar tactics. All empires need an enemy and all need natural resources–especially for a nation that consumes as much as america.
History is written by the ones who win.

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By: Right Reading Roundup 1-11-10 at Maggie’s Notebook « Daily News

Right Reading Roundup 1-11-10 at Maggie’s Notebook « Daily News — Mon, 11 Jan 2010 23:27:13 +0000

[...] The Lonely Conservative gets into “Oliver Stone’s Secret History of America” and his much-expected, revisionist history of Stalin, Hitler and Mao. Oh come on Karen. You know Stone will be completely unbiased, as always. [...]

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